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户尔北京 | 范尼·吉奎尔个展「现在，随后」—— 微型表演与小型论坛回顾

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9月7日，在户尔空间搬到798两周年之际，画廊很荣幸地邀请到于渺、龙星如、陈立、杨天歌、蔡司晗参与范尼·吉奎尔个展的微型表演与小型论坛。

期间，表演者与嘉宾激活了部分作品，并就 艺术家范尼·吉奎尔的创作进行延伸性讨论。

下文整理自讨论精彩片段。

户尔北京 | 范尼·吉奎尔个展「现在，随后」—— 微型表演与小型论坛回顾博文精选户尔空间崇真艺客

「现在，随后」小型论坛现场

嘉宾左起：杨天歌于渺龙星如陈立蔡司晗

Q：杨天歌

今天到场的都是专业的舞者和参与者，呈现出极具默契的表演。有跟作品很恰切的，也有自我表达的部分，首先想先请各位参与者聊聊在表演过程中的感受。

Today, we have invited professional dancers and participants, who gave a very tacit performance. Some of them are quite appropriate for the work, and some of them are self-expressive. So first of all, I would like to invite all the participants to talk about their feelings during the performance.

于渺

当我走进来时我就进入了状态，把自己从一个社会身份变成了一个中立的身体。“激活”是艺术家设定的机制，那么我想这些物体是否愿意被激活？什么赋予我权利去激活它？在我看来，我是用我的生命与它感应，这是一种双方的激活，我们两者的关系是“互惠”的。这不仅仅是我与作品之间的互惠，我与表演者之间也存在着能量的互惠，这也是我能放松下来的原因。

When I walked into the gallery, I was all in. I transformed myself from a social identity into a neutral body. "Activation" is a mechanism set by the artist, so I wonder if these objects want to be activated? What gives me the right to activate it? In my mind, I am in touch with it with my life. It's a two-way activation, and our relationship is "reciprocal." It's not just the reciprocity between me and the work, it's also the reciprocity of energy between me and the performer, and that's why I can relax.

我之所以对于艺术家这组石蜡的作品抱有浓厚兴趣，是因为我最近正在跟踪一座亚洲最大的石蜡厂。石蜡从石油和页岩油中通过巨型的陌生机器中提炼，变成一种资源化的产品。而《失落小星球》这件作品是私密的，带有女性的体温。于是当我观看它时，我需要跨越这种陌生感，去思考这其中更深层的互惠关系。

I was interested in the artist's paraffin work because I was recently researching one of the largest paraffin factories in Asia. Paraffin is extracted from petroleum and shale oil by giant, unfamiliar machines and turned into a resource product. "The little lost planets" is intimate, with the body heat of a woman. So when I watch it, I need to move beyond the strangeness and think about the deeper reciprocal relationship.

范尼·吉奎尔 Fanny Gicquel

失落小星球 The little lost planets｜2022

石蜡，有机材料 paraffin,organic objects | 直径约6cm Diameter about 6cm

龙星如

这是我第二次来到《现在，随后》这场展览现场，跟第一次的感触完全一样。Fanny的作品有一些非语法性的东西，当我们用我们所熟知的符号来观看的时候，当我们习惯性地认为这种材质或造型象征着什么的时候，那么你会看不懂这个展览。如果讲到这个作品应该有的表演的样子，其实我反而觉得它没有一个应该有的样子。因为它很welcoming，它应该允许任何一个人以任何一个感到舒适自然的方式去跟它相处，而不是有一个program的、被设计好的对话形式。我曾做过一个训练，如何在不睁开眼睛的情况下感受到周围还有谁。那是我第一次感受到我们的感官边界未必是靠视听决定的，有很多细微的因素在发挥着作用，人类也许就是有这样的能力。

This is the second time I have been to the exhibition site, and the feeling is exactly the same as the first time. There is something ungrammatical about Fanny's work. When we look at it in familiar symbols, when we are conditioned to think that the material or shape represents something, then you don't understand the exhibition. When it comes to how these works should be performed, in fact, I think there is no such thing. Because it should allow anyone to get along with it in any way that feels comfortable and natural, rather than having a designed form of dialogue with it. I once did a drill on how to sense who else was around without opening my eyes. It was the first time I realized that our sensory boundaries are not necessarily audiovisual, that there are many subtle factors at play, and that maybe humans do have this ability.

陈立

尽管这些物质是welcoming的，但是它依然饱含着艺术家所设定的秩序，这些物质实际上在等待着某种秩序去启动它。所以我最在乎的一点是：这些物是什么？它们与我们的表演之间的关系是什么？这些物的主体存在吗？它一定需要我们去互动的吗？这是我想说的第一点。第二点是，我被分配到了《敏感表面：感》那件作品，作为表演者我当时的生理感受，包括我手的温度和物的流动性，让我想到很多年前看的一本书《风姿花传》。这四个字是关于日本能剧的一句谚语，意思是风的姿态靠花来传递的。那么我们这场表演的随机性、表演的姿态是靠什么传递的？依然是物质。这是奇妙之处，也是我想讨论的部分。

Although these objects were welcoming, it was still an order that the artist laid out, and these objects were actually waiting for order to initiate it. So one of the things I care about most is what these objects are and how they relate to our performance. Are there subjects of these things that we have to interact with? That's the first point I want to make. Secondly, I was assigned to the work "Sensitive Surface: Thermotactile". My physical feelings as a performer at that time, including the temperature of my hands and the fluidity of objects, reminded me of the book "FengZi HuaChuan" I read many years ago. These four words are a Japanese proverb, meaning that the posture of the wind is conveyed by the flowers. So how do we convey the randomness of our performance and our posture? It's still material. That's the wonderful part, and that's what I want to talk about.

范尼·吉奎尔 Fanny Gicquel

敏感表面：感 Sensitive surface: thermotactile｜2022

钢材，热敏涂料 steel,thermo-sensitive paining | 80×200cm/pc2

蔡司晗

这次表演跟上次一样，更像是在学习一种语言，在接收到一种语言后，再去和他人交流。找到一个共鸣点，从当下出发，像是一个临时的游戏场。规则是为了让人发挥它重要的部分，机制的存在也是为了让大家更好地互动。刚走进来的时候我能感受到很强的约束性，我能做的其实很少。但是通过与大家的互动，能做的事情变多了。所以这场表演的可能性是需要通过我们之间的互动而产生，这是一个很有弹性的状态和体验，所以我也很感谢大家。

This performance, like last time, is like learning a language. After you receive a language, you communicate with others. Find a point of articulation and start from the present, like a temporary playfield. Rules are there to allow people to play important parts of the game, and mechanics are there to allow people to interact better. When I first walked in, I felt very constrained, and there was very little I could do. But there's so much more you can do by interacting with people. So the possibility of this performance has to be created through the interaction between us, which is a very resilient state. Thank you very much.

Q：杨天歌

这次展览的特别之处在于，常见的绘画及雕塑作品其客体本身是明确的、完满的。而这次的作品一方面会令人感到欠缺，因为它需要你的表演；另一方面又会感觉到物是大于人的。艺术家没有来展览现场，但她倾注了很多心思在展览的呈现上，并花了大量的时间在线上与表演者进行沟通。接下来我想问的问题是：是否没有了表演，作品就不够完整？关于这方面想听听大家的看法。

What makes this exhibition special is that the common paintings and sculptures are very specific as individuals. On the one hand, the work feels lacking because it requires you to perform. On the other hand, it can make people feel that materials are more important than people. The artist did not come to the exhibition, but she spent a lot of time communicating with the performers online. The next question I want to ask is: is the work incomplete without performance? I would like to hear your views on this.

陈立

我们如何看待表演性与物质关系的问题——什么叫在场，什么不在场；你所期待的是什么，或者你的身份是什么。在这些物质上，我能够充分的感受到艺术家的野心，和形式语言的期待。她最有价值的部分恰恰在于这种创造性的互动,也就是艺术家在每件作品中所构建的秩序，这是内核。看似随机，但它其实是一个通道，是连接着所有单件作品的最有价值的东西。

Questions about how we look at the relationship between performativity and materiality—what is present and what is not; what you expect, or what your identity is. In these materials, I can fully feel the ambition of the artist and the expectation of formal language. The most valuable part of her is precisely this creative activity, the order she constructs in each piece, which is the core. Seemingly random, it is actually a channel, the most valuable thing that connects all the individual work.

龙星如

我觉得她还是有很多在场的部分的，比如石蜡的作品中凝结了艺术家的生活痕迹，日常的、细小的，甚至被认为是垃圾的东西（例如毛发）也被封存在石蜡中，它包含着艺术家大量的身体痕迹。所以我并不认为，当我们论起一个东西的表演性的时候需要一个当下的规则。这些物质作为表演性行为的承载体，通过多次展览与人们多次接触，所以我说很多东西是在场的。我碰过的作品都是往下挂着的，我能感受到它下坠的重力，以及它自身的重量与我的身体间的关系。在那个时刻它是在场的，我能感受到的物的在场比周围人的在场更加强烈。

I think she still has a lot of parts present. For example, The traces of the artist's life are congealed in the works of paraffin. The daily, small and even trash things (such as hair) are also sealed in paraffin, which contains a lot of traces of the artist's body. Therefore, when we talk about the performativity of a material, we should also focus on the rules of the moment. These substances, as carriers of performative behavior, contact with the audience through multiple exhibitions, so I say that many things are present. When I hold the works that hangs down, I can feel the gravity of its falling and the relationship between its own weight and my body. It is present at this moment, and the presence of the objects I can feel is stronger than the presence of the people around me.

范尼·吉奎尔 Fanny Gicquel

深海中的光，人鱼的泪 Light from the sea-tears of mermaids｜2022

玻璃，蜡线 polished glass,scientific glass,waxed coed | 尺寸可变 variable dimensions

于渺

艺术家的不在场恰恰成全了这些作品。正是因为她的不在场，多少的Dancer、编舞者、策展人及其他参与者在重建秩序，重新设定了当下的场域。艺术家的不在场使她的毛发、她可能留下的气味、她对于物质的偏好、包括树脂上的印记等等，全部被放大了。

By paraphrasing the order set by artists, dancers, choreographers, curators and other participants are re-establishing the order and re-setting the current field. The absence of the artist magnifies her hair, the smells she may have left, her preferences for substances, including the imprint on resin.

我会稍微觉得Fanny的作品有一点有迹可循。换言之，我们能够清晰地看到Fanny在六十年代以降观念艺术史中的师承线索，包括Anna Halprin、Yvonne Rainer这些伟大的舞者通过提取日常经验来强调个体与空间的交流等观念实践。这些都是提示Fanny创作的历史近景。而她所毕业的法国布里坦尼雷恩美院非常注重日常材料的探索性教学，这很大程度上也影响了她的物质美学以及表演中物的使用。最后我想说的是，虽然Fanny的作品用了很多温柔的色彩和材料，但是我能感受到她并不想把她的脆弱性以及内心中很多不确定的东西展示出来，她试图在高度的掌控中遮掩某些脆弱，这些都让这个作品略显坚硬。我相信随着艺术家越发成熟，她能够逐渐松弛下来，接纳并拥抱那些不确定性，把更多的自由和随机让渡给时空中不可控的力量，那将是更迷人的现场。

I feel a little bit like Fanny's work is traceable. In other words, we can clearly see Fanny's teaching clues in the history of conceptual art in the 1960s, including Anna Halprin, Yvonne Rainer and other great dancers who emphasized the communication between individuals and space through the extraction of daily experience. These are the historical close-ups that inspired Fanny's creation. The French Academy of Fine Arts in Brittany, where she graduated, attaches great importance to the exploratory teaching of daily materials, which has also greatly influenced her material aesthetics and the use of objects in performances. Finally, I would like to say that although Fanny's works use a lot of soft colors and materials, I can feel that she does not want to show her fragility and many uncertain things in her heart. She tries to hide some fragility in a high degree of control, which makes this work slightly hard. I believe that as the artist becomes more mature, she can gradually relax, accept and embrace those uncertainties, and surrender more freedom and randomness to uncontrollable forces in time and space, which will be a more fascinating scene.

杨天歌

于渺老师的话让我想起以Steve Paxton为代表的一批从观念艺术起源并影响到舞蹈的艺术家。然而在我看来Fanny的特别之处在于，她用纯粹的身体特别是未经专业训练的身体来创作的同时，也融入了很多材料性的东西，包括阶段性的材料试验和积累。我会把我们今天的Feedback传递给她，也许未来会有其他的契机可以实现更多的可能。

I think of a group of artists represented by Steve Paxton who originated from conceptual art and influenced dance. However, what makes Fanny special, in my opinion, is that she uses the pure body, especially the untrained body, to create, while also incorporating a lot of material things, including periodic material experiments and accumulation. I will give Feedback to her, and maybe there will be other opportunities to realize more possibilities in the future.

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于渺

Mia Yu

研究者，策展人，长期关注展览史、亚洲现当代艺术史和生态媒介史。她曾获得第十四届AAC艺术中国年度策展人提名、 2018年YISHU当代艺术批评奖、2017年泰特美术馆亚洲研究奖和2015年CCAA当代艺术批评奖。曾担任Hyundai Blue Prize、Art021x保时捷青年艺术奖以及青年艺术100的评委。于渺是2021年OCAT双年展的联合策展人、2020年集美阿尔勒国际摄影节发现奖单元的策展人。她参与写作的英文文集《Uncooperative Contemporaries: Shanghai Art Exhibitions in 2000》于2020年由伦敦艺术大学Afterall展览史研究中心出版。于渺在中国美术学院国际MFA和伦敦艺术大学教授艺术史和策展实践的课程，也是北京大学《中国当代艺术年鉴》的编委。于渺是“北方x 人类世”策展项目的发起人，以泛东北亚地区作为时空切片来探寻生态政治、能源历史和超自然力量之间的缠绕。

户尔北京 | 范尼·吉奎尔个展「现在，随后」—— 微型表演与小型论坛回顾博文精选户尔空间崇真艺客

龙星如

Iris Long

策展人，写作者，研究方向为艺术创作与当代科技环境及技术的关系。译《重思策展：新媒体后的艺术》并获第十一届AAC艺术中国年度艺术出版物提名；第一届IAAC国际艺术评论奖英文入围评论者；策划展览包括《撒谎的索菲亚和嘲讽的艾莉克莎》（Hyundai Blue Prize策展人奖）等。2020年担任计算机图形学会议SIGGRAPH ASIA艺术板块国际评委。研究发表于ZKM媒体艺术中心“艺术与人工智能”会议，香港城市大学运算媒体艺术国际论坛（ISCMA）等。

户尔北京 | 范尼·吉奎尔个展「现在，随后」—— 微型表演与小型论坛回顾博文精选户尔空间崇真艺客

杨天歌

Yang Tiange

策展人，写作者。他曾于北京户尔空间、歌德学院、中间美术馆等地策划“合作，为了污染，不为完善”、“佛系青年：冷漠与共”、“海面之下是火山”、“纸本·设色：关怀与趣味”等主题性群展。他长期关注二十世纪中国本土与国际当代艺术，并在近期的研究中聚焦于其中的身体、身份认同与民族形式建构问题。

户尔北京 | 范尼·吉奎尔个展「现在，随后」—— 微型表演与小型论坛回顾博文精选户尔空间崇真艺客

陈立

Leo Chen

独立策展人，研究者，现生活并工作在中国北京。他曾于魔金石空间担任研究主管，并在香港与内地从事独立策展。他的研究主要关注于地缘政治、表演性及流动影像，探索身份与主体的复杂性，及其如何超越地理的界限。他曾于广东时代美术馆、泰康空间、Para Site、OCAT等艺术机构策划展览，亦曾参与了多个国际驻留项目，如2016年亚洲艺术文献库研究者驻留，2019年韩国国立现代美术馆国际研究者项目驻留，并于2019年获得亚洲文化协会纽约策展驻留奖助金。

户尔北京 | 范尼·吉奎尔个展「现在，随后」—— 微型表演与小型论坛回顾博文精选户尔空间崇真艺客

蔡司晗

Sihan Cai

游戏创作者，声音创作者。工作关注广泛意义上的游戏性，以及其对身体，行为，环境和社会的影响，尝试在高度分野的文化脉络中寻找一条连贯的通路。作品涵盖电子游戏、装置、声音、表演等，曾展出于北京歌德学院（德国文化中心）、三影堂摄影艺术中心。

关于户尔空间

About Hua International

户尔空间（Hua International）是一家位于柏林与北京两地的当代艺术画廊，展览、出版和公共项目致力于跨学科及行为表演的艺术实践。画廊专注于发展与艺术家长期动态的合作关系，以其地理上的两地性为依托，扩展艺术家及其作品在迥异文化背景下的展览和接受。

以 XC.Hua 为名，经历了两年实验艺术策展项目运营积累后，花笑婵于2020年8月正式更名成立了户尔空间（Hua International），并在北京798艺术区、柏林历史悠久的当代艺术中心之一麦卡托庭院分别设立空间。在常驻两地空间之外，户尔空间也在国际知名的艺术博览会展示其艺术家作品。

Hua International is a contemporary art gallery located in Berlin and Beijing whose exhibitions, publications, and public programming supports cross-disciplinary and performative artistic practices. The gallery focuses on developing long-term relationships with its represented artists and leverages its geographic bilocation as a means to critically expand how their work can be presented and received in radically diverse cultural contexts.

After two years curating the experimental art and performance project XC.Hua, Xioachan Hua founded Hua International in August 2020 and inaugurated the new gallery with spaces in Berlin’s historic Mercator Höfe and Beijing’s acclaimed 798 Arts District. In addition to its programming in Germany and China, Hua International has presented its artists in prestigious international art fairs.